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Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » The Horse's Head » Summit Mafia - Game thread
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Topic Subject:Summit Mafia - Game thread
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VisMaior
Pleb
posted 11-18-05 18:34 ET (US)         
World peace is at a hands reach at last! All you gotta do, is choose a leader for the whole world, and humanity is set! Only the most influental men come into consideration for that. So it comes to be, that the most famous leaders of all time assemble in the most exclusive hotel in existence, to choose one of their ranks to take the honor. Alas, all is not well, as a few megalomaniacs decided, that they would like to eliminate the chance that someone else gets to be world leader. Its up to you to root them out, before they gain control and take over the world! (And not to mention kill you in the process...)

Alive 3/12
------
street hobo
Niempie
Supa_Psyche

Dead 9
-----
Ovidius, hotel manager
WeaveCaesar, hotel detective
Watchwood, Achilles of the greek, slaver
Debbie, Julius Gaius Caesar of the romans, seeking mason
CenturionZ_1, Mao Zedong, leader of the chineese, townie deluxe
DarthBane, Caesar Nero, SK
Nonchalant, Genghis Khan, nation vigilante
Kedi, Richard Lionheart, townie
Sul, Cleopatra, dormant mason

[This message has been edited by VisMaior (edited 01-02-2006 @ 03:10 PM).]

AuthorReplies:
Nonchalant
Pleb
posted 11-22-05 18:09 ET (US)     26 / 214       
Well, we defnitely woul dhave had a lot more to go on had we started on Night. That way, we could have seen the country/leader that was killed and could determine the nature and corrleation between nations and roles. For example, if Churchill/Great Britain had been killed night 0, we would know we were dealing with a World War 2 scenario and we could roughly guess roles and amount of mafia, if there would be a SK, etc...

As it is now, we have virtually nothing to go on, so I guess I'll just stay with my random vote.

Kedi
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 02:03 ET (US)     27 / 214       
Okay then, for the sake of engendering discussion and hopefully avoiding a random lynch that could take out one of the good guys, let me say that I'm Richard the Lionheart and I'm one of the good guys.

Smile!
WeaveCaesar
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 06:40 ET (US)     28 / 214       

Quote:

we would know we were dealing with a World War 2 scenario

Im pretty sure it's just famous leaders from any age. We might have Nixon and Genghis Khan, I dont think the period is relevant.


Why does everyone think I killed Debbie?
Debbie
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 07:52 ET (US)     29 / 214       
*agrees with Weave about the any age*


I don't know if a mass role claim would be good or bad. Thoughts anyone? I'd be willing.....


....but, if the "megalomaniacs" are random, a mass role claim would not help us at all.


Why do I always get blamed when Weave shows up dead?
Kedi
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 08:16 ET (US)     30 / 214       
Well, even if it isn't any help, could it be a hindrance to the good guys? If not, then let's do it anyway. It'll reveal some kind of information, useful or not, and we may be able to base our votes on something rather than nothing.

Smile!
Niempie
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 08:23 ET (US)     31 / 214       
Mass claim, hmm usually a good mod will have thought of that occuring, so they make sure that a mass role claim doesn't break the game. I.e. by making known good caracters, bad in his game and bad characters, good.

So I don't know if a mass role claim will provide us enough information to lynch a bad guy.

This could even help the bad guys if the doc or cop in this game are very easy to tell by their role name,as said before as example, Sweden could be the doc, so a Swedish leader could be the doc and the mafia has an easy target tonight.

Just a few quick thoughts about this. So maybe I'm seeing this entirely wrong.


No one is listening until you make a mistake
Debbie
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 09:44 ET (US)     32 / 214       

Quote:

Well, even if it isn't any help, could it be a hindrance to the good guys?

I don't see how it would be a hinderance. And nobody says that the doc has to be from Sweden. why would a swede be a doc? who would a world leader from sweden be anyway? The bad guys already know who each other are and I don't think just character names would help them discern who is a doc or a cop, just as I'm not sure that just character names would help us discern who the scum are.


Why do I always get blamed when Weave shows up dead?
WeaveCaesar
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 10:58 ET (US)     33 / 214       
I dont see the benefit in nation revealing. Surely it's just a waste of time to declare our nations?

Why does everyone think I killed Debbie?
street hobo
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 14:13 ET (US)     34 / 214       
Hmm... sorry about the slow start.

Reading the thread, normally I'm totally against no-lynches, but Ovi makes it sound like it might be worth the wait to confirm a pro town player.

Also, the mass nation claim might actually be a good strategy for the town, because it helps weed out badguys, but without the risk of normal games, where you must give out your role.

watchwood
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 15:21 ET (US)     35 / 214       
The mass nation claim could be useful, assuming that the Vis hasn't hid the scum players in amongst normally good nations.


I'm Your Daddy
92% of teens have moved on to rap. If you are part of the 8% who still listen to real music, copy and paste this into your sig.
Can't believe on back on this damned site again.
Debbie
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 15:29 ET (US)     36 / 214       

Quote:

I dont see the benefit in nation revealing. Surely it's just a waste of time to declare our nations?

how did we go from name role claim to nation claim? What I assume is my "nation" is not really a "nation"


Why do I always get blamed when Weave shows up dead?
Kedi
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 17:36 ET (US)     37 / 214       
Hmmm, well my nation is clearly a nation, so does this mean you're one of the bad guys, Debbie?????

Smile!
Debbie
Pleb
posted 11-23-05 23:33 ET (US)     38 / 214       
I have more of an empire....

Why do I always get blamed when Weave shows up dead?
Supa_Psyche
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 01:12 ET (US)     39 / 214       

Quote:

I dont see the benefit in nation revealing. Surely it's just a waste of time to declare our nations?

I tend to agree. But I don't think revealing them would do any harm.

unvote

Vote:Sul


"ALL POWER TO THE SOVIET" - Natalina
"GROW THE HELL UP, OD!" - Izzy
"ISNT THE RIGHT TO EMULATE POWERUPS FROM SUPER MARIO PROTECTED BY THE AMERICAN CONSTITUTION???" - legion
Kedi
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 02:42 ET (US)     40 / 214       

Quoted from WeaveCaesar:

I dont see the benefit in nation revealing. Surely it's just a waste of time to declare our nations?

No more a waste of time than what's (not) happening now, and at least it'll give us a talking point, helpful or not.

So, let me reiterate, I'm Richard the Lionheart, King of the Britons. Now, name claim or role claim as you wish, but for goodness' sake, do something!


Smile!
Ovidius
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 05:51 ET (US)     41 / 214       
To claim or not to claim? What is the question?

We have, on one side, the pro-mass claim camp:
Kedi ("I'm Richard the Lionheart, King of the Britons. Now, name claim or role claim as you wish, but for goodness' sake, do something!")
Watchwood ("The mass nation claim could be useful, assuming that the Vis hasn't hid the scum players in amongst normally good nations.")
Street Hobo ("Also, the mass nation claim might actually be a good strategy for the town, because it helps weed out badguys, but without the risk of normal games, where you must give out your role.")
Supa_Psyche ("I tend to agree. But I don't think revealing them would do any harm.") (Actually he's probably just on the pro side of neutral)

And on the other, the anti-mass claim camp:
Niempie ("So I don't know if a mass role claim will provide us enough information to lynch a bad guy.")
Weave ("I dont see the benefit in nation revealing. Surely it's just a waste of time to declare our nations?")
Ovidius (I tend to be against this. I doubt Vis would make real-life 'baddies' evil in the game... that'd be too easy. And surely the real-life 'alignment' is ambiguous, depending on your perspective? I come from a country of vastly differing perspectives on the 'alignments' of past and present leaders. )

And in the middle, the undecideds and the apparently completely ambiguous:
Debbie ("I don't see how it would be a hinderance... The bad guys already know who each other are and I don't think just character names would help them discern who is a doc or a cop, just as I'm not sure that just character names would help us discern who the scum are.")

And in the middle of the middle, those who have not engaged with the issue (yet):
DarthBane, Nonchalant, CenturionZ_1, Sul

Now, I find it interesting that of the pro-claimers, only Kedi has actually claimed. I also disagree with those who think the claim will not be a hindrance... too many games get bogged down in claims that reveal nothing about alignment. The only chance we have here of catching someone out is if someone claims someone else's name/nation and given that we seem not to be constrained by a specific period, the chances of that happening are slim.

I still believe getting a quick investigation result is probably more important than lynching randomly. Therefore, I'll VOTE NO LYNCH.

Ok, now you can all go up in arms about me wrongly classifying your position!


And the neural alignment of Ovidius is also very strange - Niempie
Nonchalant
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 13:16 ET (US)     42 / 214       
I'm going to concur with Ovi here and also go for a no lynch. Personally, if we role claim, I see one of two things happening.

First, it either doesn't help us in the least. By this I mean townies can't detect mafia membres, and mafia can't detect cops or vigs or docs or whatever. While it might get things out in the open a bit more, it might be better to save this for a later stage in the game.

Second, we are able to make educated guesses about people's roles from their nations. However, the mafia will be able to do the same, and so we have to decide whether it's worth the risk to have the mafia know all the powerful pro-town roles.

Also, I fear the state names might be a little bit ambiguous. While it is true that some countries are somewhat stereotypical or have characteristics, it isn't necessarily true that the mod went by the most obvvious ones (for exaample, Roman Empire can be seen as mafia, since it conquered the known world, or doc, because it was much more advanced than other countries at the time, or cop, for some other reason). Basically, country names are far too ambiguous to be of much help at the moment. This isn't to say that we should never mass role-claim, but I just say prudence, since, at the moment, more info will help mafia much more than it'll help us. However, as soon as we get more info and understand how the states' names thing works, then we should mass claim and we'll be able to decipher state names more.

My 2 cents.

unvote
vote: no lynch

CenturionZ_1
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 14:54 ET (US)     43 / 214       
I concur.

Vote: No Lynch

My state name (or head of state I am representing) really has little correlation with my role. I don't think lynching anyone will lead to any use for the 'town' as we cannot be sure if we lynched a good guy or scum.

Besides, the scum will know each other anyway and any random lynch will probably end up being a townie. Given that night follows day, that's 2 dead townies before we have any major clues.


CenturionZ_1
HG Angel
AoEH Staff

'In heaven an angel is nobody in particular.' - George Bernard Shaw
Age of Empires Heaven Agetoons About Me
Kedi
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 17:17 ET (US)     44 / 214       
Going with the flow: Vote: No lynch

Smile!
WeaveCaesar
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 18:09 ET (US)     45 / 214       
A No lynch has to be applied in respect to the circumstances, and I am all in favour of it in teh right situation. Which I believe to be now.

unvote

vote No Lynch


Why does everyone think I killed Debbie?
watchwood
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 18:46 ET (US)     46 / 214       
While I can see where you are collectively coming from with this argument for a no lynch, I'm not entirely sure that it's the best thing, as a long series of cases have proven. Thus, I won't be casting my vote along into this possibly ill-fated venture.


I'm Your Daddy
92% of teens have moved on to rap. If you are part of the 8% who still listen to real music, copy and paste this into your sig.
Can't believe on back on this damned site again.
street hobo
Pleb
posted 11-24-05 22:04 ET (US)     47 / 214       

Quote:

as a long series of cases have proven

Yeah, normally, but this game so different mechanically.

vote no lynch

WeaveCaesar
Pleb
posted 11-25-05 05:43 ET (US)     48 / 214       
ww, Can you explain your reasoning behind why a no lynch day 1 is bad?

Why does everyone think I killed Debbie?
Supa_Psyche
Pleb
posted 11-25-05 06:11 ET (US)     49 / 214       
The main reason is that it gives the scum a free night. But, seeing as we started this game in day, and we have no choice to lynch, it's probably our best option.

Either that, or we could lynch the lurkers, but that has a far greater possibility to do more harm than good, whereas voting for a no-lynch will lead us to break even so to speak.

unvote

Vote:No Lynch


"ALL POWER TO THE SOVIET" - Natalina
"GROW THE HELL UP, OD!" - Izzy
"ISNT THE RIGHT TO EMULATE POWERUPS FROM SUPER MARIO PROTECTED BY THE AMERICAN CONSTITUTION???" - legion
Kedi
Pleb
posted 11-25-05 08:54 ET (US)     50 / 214       
Does Sul know we're playing already? Any posts at all yet??
Also, by my count, we've got a majority vote for No Lynch right now (Ovidius, Nonchalant, CenturionZ_1, WeaveCaesar, street hobo, Supa_Psyche and myself). Does that mean it's night now?

Smile!
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