You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Pharaoh: Game Help
Moderated by VitruviusAIA, Gweilo

Hop to:    
Welcome! You are not logged in. Please Login or Register.434 replies, Sticky
Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » Pharaoh: Game Help » Housing Blocks
Bottom
Topic Subject:Housing Blocks
« Previous Page  1 ··· 8 9 10 11 12 ··· 18  Next Page »
VitruviusAIA
The Architect
posted 11-24-00 17:49 ET (US)         
No one has posted any new housing blocks for a while, and I thought that it was time that someone (me) did so. You won’t find anything really new here, as this subject has been covered very well. Most of what I’m posting are just my variations on housing blocks that others have developed.

I have supplied the glyphs in this post with “tags”. To see what the glyph represents, just move your cursor over the symbol, and the tag will pop-up.

I have also posted housing blocks in the threads Baki-Balancing Housing Blocks and Ratings, Estate Block Alternatives and A New Concept for Housing Blocks.


Vaia

[This message has been edited by VitruviusAIA (edited 01-26-2006 @ 03:05 PM).]

AuthorReplies:
Thorfin
Pleb
posted 03-07-06 12:44 ET (US)     226 / 434       
Firefox and Opera both implement the standard "properly". ALT is not supposed to be used for that, but instead you are supposed to use TITLE. IE doesn't really care, though, and as a result, everyone has been using ALT improperly for years.

If you (like me) don't really see what the whole stink is about, just download an extension that displays ALT tags. The one I use is at http://piro.sakura.ne.jp/xul/_popupalt.html.en, but there are plenty of others out there.

After installing it, you will have to close Firefox and restart the browser for it to take effect.

RoyofSF
Pleb
posted 03-08-06 11:49 ET (US)     227 / 434       
Thank you, Thorfin. It looks like it works with Firefox 1.5. One question-it has no negative effect on the browser, right?

Cheers, RoyofSF
Windows Pro XP/SP 2
Thorfin
Pleb
posted 03-08-06 16:59 ET (US)     228 / 434       
I haven't run into anything yet, RoyofSF. And more significantly, I guess, there are lots of other people out there using it, probably a whole lot more than I am, and I would think they would have found problems if they were there.

I was working up relatively compact worker block (42 tile path) with perfect venue (except for senet) with the requirement that both sides of the block have nothing but houses, and that there are no external constraints on where entertainers travel.

Hit on something I think is quite neat -- 25 Elegant Residences (2200 pop) on Very Hard, though it is then short on music venues by 100 people. There are only a couple that depend on adjacent houses evolving. I hadn't counted on going that far, so I didn't even consider two gods -- I was initially shooting for just Common Residence to get rid of all the 1x1s. In most cases, I'd probably just leave them at Spacious, and then you have perfect venues. And I'd probably trade out one of the Residences on the inner block for a Tax Collector if there's a Palace somewhere, too, now that I think about it.

Anyway, every house should have 60 entertainer points, depending on what schools you have, plus a city bonus of 14, so in retrospect, the three juggler booths in the back of the block aren't really necessary. Drops you to around a city bonus of 12 or so. And also saves you one fireman.

Enough rambling!

25 Elegant Residences -- Very Hard

Large Statue
ApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentMusic StageEntertainer RoadDance Stage
DentistShrineEntertainer Road
BazaarEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
ShrineShrineTempleWater SupplyApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentArchitect's PostJuggler BoothEntertainer RoadJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
ShrineShrineShrineApartmentEntertainer RoadMusic StageJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
Scribal SchoolApartmentCourthouseShrineShrineEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
ShrineApartmentApartmentPhysicianApartmentFire WardenShrineEntertainer RoadJuggler BoothFire Warden
ApartmentShrineShrineShrineApothecaryJuggler BoothEntertainer RoadJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
Entertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
ApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentMusic StageEntertainer RoadDance StageLarge Statue
ShrineShrineEntertainer Road
Legend

[This message has been edited by Thorfin (edited 03-08-2006 @ 05:27 PM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 03-08-06 23:04 ET (US)     229 / 434       
Thorfin,

Unless you like the look of elegant residences, I recommend evolving them to fancy residences. This is more important at Very Hard difficulty, where per capita taxes are 33% greater in fancy residences. The only systematic disadvantage to fancy residences is that when Bast's temple complex or Sebek's altar exists, per capita food consumption is about 8% greater in full fancy residences than in full elegant residences. (When Bast's temple complex and Sebek's alter don't exist, per capita food consumption is about 4% less in full fancy residences than in full elegant residences.)

Also, if you eliminate the extra firehouse and booths then you'll also need to eliminate the bandstand.

[edit-removed incorrect comment about apothecary]

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 03-09-2006 @ 02:15 PM).]

Thorfin
Pleb
posted 03-11-06 01:39 ET (US)     230 / 434       
Good point. Agreed. Usally, I wouldn't stop at that point, either. I was in a scenario where I had to import linen (not even flax), so in practice, they were capped at Spacious Residence. I had just noticed while playing that several of them were being held back by linen, so I checked to see if I could jigger them all around a bit to make them all go. I wouldn't bother to build a block like that -- aesthetically, its ugly, and practically speaking, very tough to build ("OK, count over three squares, put in a shrine, move up one, put in a shrine, then a garden, then a block of 8 houses, then... AAAAHHHH!")

Interesting stuff about the Altar. I did not know that.

Taking your advice, I set about creating a block which satisfies my requirement, and evolves to Fancy. (OK, I didn't quite satisfy my requirements -- I'm 16 people over perfect music stages, but slightly over 2 booths short of perfect.) I'm tempted to replace one of the center SYs with a booth/juggler school/booth -- either that or just slide the bandstand back, add a house, and add another bandstand, fireman and juggler booth, kind of similar to the previous design.

The other criterion I set upon myself was that it had to allow the labor seekers to walk next to the houses, and be fault tolerant about putting SYs right across the street, i.e., the 55 desirability must be on the inside, with a "worst case" SY, so orientation doesn't matter. (If the SY is on the NW or NE side, the inner tile just has more desirability than necessary.) And just to make it slightly tougher, I wanted to be able to place the granaries anywhere on the road in on the left side of the development so to make sure, I developed it with granaries, since SYs can't reach the inner house tile, regardless of orientation. In play, of course, some of those would be SYs.

Oh, and I wanted to incorporate some Brugle Storage Yards, and the VAIA(?) variant. And I included what I was talking about with the roadblocked industry loops. The other thing I wanted the option for was just a long road about 25 tiles long with a work camp and a fireman at one end that tees onto the side of the block. (Replacing one of the industry loops, I mean.)

Anyway, I haven't playtested it but everything seems to be in order, so far as I can tell. Any suggestions?
PotterWeaverWeaverPapyrus MakerPapyrus MakerBreweryBrewery
PotterWeaverWeaverPapyrus MakerPapyrus MakerBreweryBrewery
PotterWeaverWeaverPapyrus MakerPapyrus MakerBreweryStorage Yard
Storage Yard
Storage Yard PotterWeaverWeaverPapyrus MakerPapyrus MakerBreweryBrewery
Storage YardPotterWeaverWeaverPapyrus MakerPapyrus MakerBreweryBrewery
Granary
Fire WardenStorage YardStorage Yard Fire WardenStorage Yard
Large StatueArchitect's Post Architect's Post
ShrineShrineShrine
GranaryMedium Statue
ShrineApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentApartmentDance StageMusic StageEntertainer Road
ShrineApartmentArchitect's PostEntertainer Road
ShrineEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
GranaryShrineApartmentPhysicianTempleCourthouseLarge StatueTempleShrineJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
ShrineShrineEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
Scribal SchoolApothecaryMusic StageEntertainer RoadJuggler Booth
ShrineApartmentBazaarApartmentApartmentWater SupplyTax CollectorApartmentFire WardenEntertainer Road
GranaryShrineDentistShrineShrineJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
ShrineApartmentEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
ShrineApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentApartmentMusic StageEntertainer RoadDance Stage
Medium StatueShrineShrineEntertainer Road
GranaryLarge Statue
ShrineStorage YardStorage YardShrineShrineStorage Yard
Architect's Post Architect's Post
Fire Warden Fire Warden
Storage Yard
Legend

NP, VAIA. That Excel spreadsheet generates glyphs so easily, and I've now incorporated a tiny macro into my text editor to change "tiles/" to "strategy/tiles/" and strip out extra CR-LF pairs, so it literally took longer to explain why it was no problem than it took to repair.

[This message has been edited by Thorfin (edited 03-11-2006 @ 07:16 PM).]

VitruviusAIA
The Architect
posted 03-11-06 18:08 ET (US)     231 / 434       
Thorfin,

Earlier today, I accidentally edited your last reply.

Everything that was in your reply was replaced with something that I intended to post in another thread. You are a former staff member, so you know about “edit history”. I was able to recall your reply, and copy the text, but there was no “code” for the glyph. I took a screenshot of the glyph in your reply, and stored/referenced it from a private gallery that I have here at HG.

I think that the resulting Reply #230 will be ok. If you still have the code for the glyph and would like to replace the image link, please do so.

This was all very careless of me, and I do apologize.


Vaia

[This message has been edited by VitruviusAIA (edited 03-11-2006 @ 06:27 PM).]

Sarahie
Pleb
posted 03-12-06 07:39 ET (US)     232 / 434       
I just tried the housing block in #230, on Normal, in the last scenario before the beginning of the Old Kingdom. Worked like a charm (even if I didn't have enough room for the full industry blocks). But Very Hard is the real test, I know, and I'm not ready for that yet--the glitches I encountered were largely through my own ineptitude (putting my only dock on a bit isolated by yearly floods! Not setting stockyards to only accept very specific goods resulting in them getting full up with barley, breaking the flow of supplies!).

I did encounter one problem directly related to the design, though. The shrines sandwiched in between the medium statue, large statue, and housing in the left part are too far from roads. I had to replace them with gardens. This might break the desirability requirements on Very Hard (it didn't on Normal, but Normal is so much easier). Might be worth checking out with one of those desirability calculators in a worst-case scenario (granaries or bad-orientation stockyards sandwiched across the room from those houses, instead of stockyards with their orientations away from the houses).

By the way, this is my first post!

EDIT: It runs fine on Very Hard. I had to go to some extra trouble to keep it stocked with the second food, but once I managed that (and I remembered to put plazas on that strip of road running through two industrial loops), it all evolved to Elegant Residences just fine. Even after I slapped some granaries right there on the left bit instead of the stockyards, just to test it. The design seems to cut it close but, even with granaries right across the street, manage enough desirability to keep up Elegant Residences. Impressive. Now to test it in the next scenario that looks like it would actually permit *Fancy* Residences.


By the way, thank you Thorfin for giving me a solution for integrating industry. I was having trouble with that.

[This message has been edited by Sarahie (edited 03-12-2006 @ 12:20 PM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 03-12-06 12:35 ET (US)     233 / 434       
Hi Sarahie, welcome to Pharaoh Heaven.

When the game says that a shrine is not adjacent to a road, the shrine will not have any effect on its god, but it is still desirable. The two shrines in reply #230 that you mentioned would not affect their god(s), but they would make the surrounding area desirable. However, those shrines won't get much damage protection, so I wouldn't build them there anyway (especially at Very Hard difficulty).

Thorfin
Pleb
posted 03-12-06 15:27 ET (US)     234 / 434       
Yeah, you are right. It was boneheaded of me to put shrines there. Good catch!

If you move them over to the other tile the statues share, it gets you close. Swapping the Tax Collector to the other side of the Water Supply makes it work.

Thusly:
Storage YardPotterWeaverWeaverPapyrus MakerPapyrus MakerBreweryBrewery
Fire WardenStorage YardStorage Yard Fire WardenStorage Yard
Large StatueArchitect's Post Architect's Post
ShrineShrineShrineShrine
Medium Statue
HouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseShrineHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseDance StageMusic StageEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseArchitect's PostHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHouseEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHousePhysicianTempleCourthouseLarge StatueTempleShrineJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHouseShrineEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
Scribal SchoolApothecaryMusic StageEntertainer RoadJuggler Booth
ShrineHouseHouseBazaarHouseHouseTax CollectorWater SupplyHouseHouseHouseHouseFire WardenEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHouseDentistShrineHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseShrineJuggler BoothEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHouseEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer RoadEntertainer Road
ShrineHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseShrineHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseMusic StageEntertainer RoadDance Stage
Medium StatueHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseShrineHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseHouseEntertainer Road
Large Statue
ShrineShrineStorage YardStorage YardShrineShrineStorage Yard
Architect's Post Architect's Post
Fire Warden Fire Warden
Legend

Oh, and welcome to the forum! Nice to hear it worked out for you. Initially, I had hoped to put the bazaar right at the entrance, for the image of walking into town. (You walk in past shrines and nice homes flanked by cat statues, large and medium, and straight ahead is the marketplace. Visually striking, I think. I'd give all the houses in town a couple points desirability just for that. Problem is, apart from the program not agreeing with me on the bonus desirability, is that it doesn't work on most maps, since the water supply limits your placement. But when it works, its pretty.

[This message has been edited by Thorfin (edited 03-12-2006 @ 09:34 PM).]

Phanatic
Pleb
posted 03-29-06 11:39 ET (US)     235 / 434       
Hello folks. It's been a while, but I'm back for my 4th run through my Family History. Beware, I'm not an expert player ... far from it. But I squeak by. For the first time ever, I'm using a block posted by one of the masters, VitruviusAIA. I've always had pretty good success with my own designs, but now that I understand more about how entertainment works, I'm amazed my blocks worked at all. I play at the lowly difficulty of normal :-)

I'm using the block posted on reply #80 on page 8 of this thread. It is rotated 180 degrees from that shown. However, for the sake of clarity, I will describe the behavior in the orientation shown. I have noticed some bizarre Bazaar antics. The Bazarr is the upgraded version. Here's what is happening:
One of the delivery ladies (not the buyer) spawns on the upper road, just across from the Bazaar. She then proceeds to take the shortest path right back to the Bazaar, ignoring the roadblocks. Thus, she only delivers goods to a handful of houses, assuming she is actually delivering anthing at all. The other delivery lady spawns at the same time, but she follows the inner loop as she should.

So far this has not really been a problem, but with just one delivery lady doing all the work, I wonder how long she can keep up, as I haven't started producing beer or linen yet.

I'm wondering, could my orientation be the cause? I might try flipping (mirroring) the block across vertical, instead of rotating it like I did. In the mission I'm on (Meidum), I really need the storage yards to the left, closer to the dock.

Thanks VitruviusAIA for such a great block.

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 03-29-06 12:37 ET (US)     236 / 434       
Phanatic,

An upgraded bazaar generates 2 bazaar traders. If the 2 traders happen to be generated at exactly the same time, then one of them typically "teleports" to an unusual tile to start her walk, while the other starts in the usual tile next to the bazaar. The behavior you describe is normal and expected, except that the teleported bazaar trader should wander around a while (just like any other service-providing walker) before returning to her bazaar (through roadblocks if necessary).

Teleporting bazaar traders can cause problems by delivering a food or good to houses that aren't supposed to have them. (For example, a bazaar trader from a block of manors might teleport and deliver a more-preferred imported food to some nearby houses which are supposed to eat a less-preferred locally-produced food.) But if that doesn't happen then teleporting bazaar traders shouldn't be a concern.

Having 2 traders from a bazaar is useful when the block contains some 1x1 homesteads or apartments, since those houses will run out of pottery (or beer in apartments) 1 to 2 months after a bazaar trader last passes. However, for other houses, having 2 traders from a bazaar isn't particularly useful. (In several cities, I've deliberately prevented some bazaars from upgrading, to avoid trader teleportation.) So, assuming that you evolve the houses to residences (or don't evolve them past cottages), 1 non-teleporting bazaar trader for the block in reply #80 should be fine. Even if houses are homesteads or apartments, the worst that should happen (assuming that the bazaar buyers can get food and goods quickly enough) is that now and then a few of the 1x1 houses will devolve for a short time.

However, the assumption in the previous sentence is crucial. If one of the bazaar buyers sometimes goes a long distance, the single bazaar in reply #80 might not be enough. But if the bazaar buyers in reply #80 goes only to the granary and storage yards shown, then I'd expect that the single bazaar would be sufficient.

Thorfin
Pleb
posted 03-29-06 12:44 ET (US)     237 / 434       
I had much the same thing happen when I used it, but I just let it run for a couple game years and it resolved itself. You can probably search the forum for threads on teleporting bazaar ladies and how to deal with them. Here's the Cliff's Notes version.

There are only two ways of avoiding the teleporting bazaar ladies of which I'm aware. One is to never let the bazaar run out of goods to distribute. Since the second lady isn't generated until the bazaar upgrades, and then either because some close houses lost negative desire, i.e., evolved while the walker was doing rounds, or because you intentionally placed some positive desire, its unlikely that the second lady will spawn on top of the first, since you control when that happens. But again, the first time you run out of stuff to distribute, they will sit at the bazaar on break until the trader lady comes back, then both spawn at the same time, one of them several tiles away, often on a road you don't want her anywhere near. If I properly interpreted what I saw, if the outer distribution lady gets back to the bazaar before the inner distribution lady is spawned the next time, the same thing will happen again. Sometimes adding a road tile here and there will make her walk out into the middle of nowhere and not get back in time, sometimes not. Much of the time, though, I find the problem just resolves itself.

The second is just to make sure the bazaar doesn't upgrade, or at least that you can place something close enough to it to make it devolve long enough to offset the two spawn times again. Placing it next to the mortuary is probably not quite enough, especially with that statue so close. I'd guess you have to also get rid of the shrines behind it so you can pop in a row of firewardens to push down desire.

Problem with moving the bazaar is that I'm pretty sure VAIA was counting on the 6 range of the bazaar to evolve houses, so it's not going to be as easy as just swapping a couple things around.

[EDIT]
I should have waited a few minutes before posting, I guess. Could have saved myself all that typing, and possible (probable) embarassment when someone explains that the bazaar problem resolving itself is a fluke. []
[/EDIT]

[This message has been edited by Thorfin (edited 03-29-2006 @ 01:00 PM).]

Phanatic
Pleb
posted 03-29-06 13:11 ET (US)     238 / 434       
Thanks Thorfin,

Assuming it's not a fluke, my Bazaar is most definitely running out of goods. I'm only producing food and pottery at this point, and not enough of either, yet.
You've given me something to work with.

Thanks again

Brugle,
Holy smokes, I just noticed that you had also replied to my post ahead of Thorfin. Somehow I completely missed it.
My apologizes. And thank you.

[This message has been edited by Phanatic (edited 03-30-2006 @ 09:27 AM).]

jackheh
Pleb
posted 04-13-06 08:35 ET (US)     239 / 434       
Just found this site, and I've found nothing like the system I developed on my own for housing

Here's the base layout
Courthouse
Osiris TempleLibrary ApartmentApartment Physician
BazaarApartmentApartmentShrineShrineApartmentApartment
Fire WardenShrineShrineJuggle platformBastet Temple
Juggle platformJuggle platform
ArchitectMortuaryTax CollectorWater SupplySchoolApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentMusic platformDance platform
ShrineShrineDentist

I like it because I can alter to suit the layout of the map (if dunes or things get in the way). Because the water supply can be placed right near the road block it can be placed far from the river, leaving space by the river for industry and, docks so that the layout can by places on both sides of the river and still be close to storage yards with the requiste goods. It's also very thin and slender and so does not require large amounts of space to be placed, nor does it's postioning need to overly considered when lay road down. Finally, with this system I never find that I need to place more juggler stands in the city to boost culture.

Here are some of the alternatives that I use.
ApartmentShrineApartmentApartment
ApartmentShrine
ApartmentApartmentShrineJuggle platform
ShrineShrineApartmentApartment
Juggle platformApartmentShrine
ApartmentApartmentShrineApartment
Shrine

ApartmentApartmentShrineApartment ApartmentApartmentShrineApartment
Shrine Shrine
ShrineShrine Apartment
ApartmentApartmentJuggle platformApartment ApartmentApartmentJuggle platformApartment
Shrine ShrineJuggle platformShrine
ApartmentApartment Apartment
ShrineApartment
Shrine

And finally there's this one (in case water is really scare). It also shows how I deal with industry. The two houses are serviced by the main block, but provide workers for the industry, entertainment trainers and food storage that I place there.
Courthouse
Osiris TempleLibrary ApartmentApartment Physician
BazaarApartmentApartmentShrineShrineApartmentApartment
HouseFire WardenShrineShrineJuggle platformBastet Temple
Juggle platformJuggle platform
HouseWater SupplyArchitectMortuaryTax CollectorSchoolApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentShrineApartmentApartmentMusic platformDance platform
ShrineShrineDentist

Legend

[This message has been edited by jackheh (edited 04-13-2006 @ 08:55 AM).]

VitruviusAIA
The Architect
posted 04-13-06 13:50 ET (US)     240 / 434       
Welcome to our forums jackheh, and thank you for your post.

“Strip Housing” (housing and support structures along a single “strip” of road with the entrance(s) roadblocked) is a valid and sometimes useful layout. I have used similar designs when I required housing for labor access and space was very limited.

However, almost always I will use a “Housing Block” (housing and support structures located around a continuous “looped” road). The advantages of a Housing Block are stability and efficiency.

Consider the location of the Architect’ Post and the Temple (which requires architect’s coverage) on the right side of your first layout. An architect will always travel at least 22 road tiles until he comes to the end of his walk and returns to the Architect’s Post (or simply disappears). Your Temple is 29 tiles away (it will receive coverage at 28 tiles). Occasionally (usually on one walk out of four), the architect will travel further. Receiving architect’s coverage on one walk in four might be ok if you play at one of the lower difficulty levels, but it will not be adequate if you play at hard or very hard.

The block that Thorfin posted in reply #230 has a 42-tile road loop. When a walker comes to the end of his walk, he will return to his home structure by the shortest path possible (even passing through roadblocks). With Thorfin’s layout, no matter which way the architect travels when he leaves his building, when he comes to the end of his walk, the shortest route back to the Architect’s Post is to complete the loop. This way, every structure in the block will receive architect’s coverage on every walk.

Housing Blocks are also much more efficient than Housing Strips. Your layout contains 12 2x2 houses. Thorfin’s layout contains 23. (My housing block in reply #42 contains 26, and the one in reply #80 has 28). Support structures required for your housing all cost money to place and require workers to function. Using Housing Blocks will leave you with more money available and will provide more workers.


Vaia
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 04-13-06 18:46 ET (US)     241 / 434       
Hi jackheh, welcome to Pharaoh Heaven.

I hate to disagree with VitruviusAIA. As far as I know, all "random" walkers have a minimum initial walk (before returning to their building or disappearing) of at least 26 tiles, and a few including architects have a minimum initial walk of over 40 tiles. Therefore, I don't see any problem with architect coverage in your housing block described in reply #239.

However, there may be a problem with some of the walkers from buildings touching the pavilion--they might get hung up in the pavilion in some or possibly all of their walks. I'd expect them to walk to the left on at least 1 walk out of 4 in most configurations, but (depending on other nearby roads) it might be possible (I don't know enough to tell) that they wouldn't.

Similarly, I would prefer for the physician to pass all houses on all of his walks. If houses are evolved to a decent level quickly then this won't matter, but at the beginning of some missions I've had huts around for quite a while, and frequent physician coverage is required to prevent disease (especially at higher difficulties). I'd suggest switching the physician and Osiris's temple.

Like VitruviusAIA, I have built similar "strip" housing blocks (when they seemed useful), but with one major difference--the main housing road is intersection-free. Either the pavilion is connected to the main housing road through a roadblock, or is replaced by a conservatory and dance school.

jackheh
Pleb
posted 04-13-06 21:19 ET (US)     242 / 434       
Thanks for your replies.

Brugle: What I posted isn't the intial layout, but my final layout. In only a fire house, police station and water supply are placed. With each building added as they are needed. With the Physican going in place of the Mortury and the Courthouse in place of the Library until I wish to place the Library and Mortury. I replace the Physican and Courthouse, because they do not require materials and I want to keep storage yard delivery journeys to a minimum.

I guess I originally developed the strips because I thought in the culture rating your was dependent on people actually having access to the services - like they do with regards to healthcare. So I created a strip with a pavilion at the end and nothing else. Then the bit on the left became too long with all the services being there and some of the houses on the right might devolve. So I reluctantly moved some of the services beside the pavilion.

I have created blocks, but only for manors and estates. I wasn't thinking about the effciency of walkers, but rather of space. I didn't want to waste space on excess statues and so I wanted to use the desirability of the Courthouse, Library, School, ws and temples in the block rather than waste it on the edges.

I've been getting back into the groove of the game and playing at normal, but from what I can remember it worked fine at hard levels and alright at very hard. The problem wasn't with the services on the right, but with the Library and School. If they decided to leave walking to the left so many times in a row then the last 8 or 4 apartments wouldn't recieve education services and devolve to spacicous apartments.

I think I just got stubborn in my use of strips. I don't remember having problems with not enough workers, but then I'd hardly have any scribes in my city and I'd have huge blocks of work camps to soak up all the labour.

VitruviusAIA
The Architect
posted 04-14-06 00:37 ET (US)     243 / 434       

Quoted from Brugle:

I hate to disagree with VitruviusAIA.


I’m glad you did. My comment was clearly in error.

Don’t know what I was thinking about when I pulled those erroneous numbers out of my head.


Vaia
gornfr
Pleb
posted 10-31-06 07:45 ET (US)     244 / 434       
Hello !

I'm a new Pharaoh player (it's amazing a so old game still has players... I wonder if recent games will last so long...), and I'd like to know how can be build palatial estates, since they are 4x4 tiles, and on most block designs, there's no road reaching the 2 rear tiles.
Could someone explain this mistery to me please ?

Thanks !

PS : I apologize if this isn't the right place to post this question, I didn't know where to post it right.

TuShaWuJin
Pleb
(id: shaun1)
posted 10-31-06 08:02 ET (US)     245 / 434       
gornfr, Welcome to Pharaoh Heaven Forum

Housing receives service whenever a walker passes within 2 tiles of the house. It doesn't require the entire house to be covered, only a single tile for services such as food and goods.
Services that reduce risk (fire/collapse/crime/disease) will be more effective the more tiles exposed to the passing walker's 5x5 coverage area. 4 tiles within the coverage area of a walker(such as an outer corner of a housing block loop) is usually enough to reduce risk from 'very high risk'(red) to nearly 0%.

[This message has been edited by shaun1 (edited 10-31-2006 @ 08:22 AM).]

Tryhard
Legate
posted 10-31-06 08:45 ET (US)     246 / 434       
Welcome, gornfr,
I have some houses that never touch a road at any tile. You may as such have houses touching the road which devolve then evolve again further away from the road (a question of desirability).

You must download Completed cities here to see live blocks.
BTW1 I have never submitted any block: my network connections from Africa are too burdensome, I deal with text. But my Palatial estates at Very hard are the most extreme: check out my 200 Palatial Estates in Alexandria, where they are 19 per block.

As for the reason why this game is still alive, gornfn:
1. The game
2. Brugle
3. At a lesser degree the rest of us.

BTW2 However excellent this thread is, maybe it should have been closed -and made sticky instead- as it is becoming so long that it may also have become confusing to forumers.

Or refreshed/compiled like The Census (but quite a task).

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 10-31-06 09:05 ET (US)     247 / 434       
Hi gornfr, welcome.

shaun may have answered your question. If not, maybe this will: when it evolves, a house will expand if it must (possibly absorbing lower-level houses). A palatial estate may start out as a 1x1 house, expanding to 2x2 when it evolves to a residence, expanding to 3x3 when it evolves to a manor, and expanding to 4x4 when it evolves to an estate.

gornfr
Pleb
posted 10-31-06 09:23 ET (US)     248 / 434       
Waow !! I'm very impressed of the speed of your answers !!

The thing I don't understand is how a house on the third tile away from a road will be covered by services such as food and goods, since the first 2 tiles will be covered, but the third ?
How are the third and the fourth tiles covered ?
I can't figure it out.
In fact, I don't even understand how a block of house can evolve to a 3x3 then 4x4 house if it has no road around it.

shaun1
When you say a walker has a 5x5 area coverage, isn't it 2 tiles to both sides of the road ?
So I guess you begin with a 2x2 house, or 2 2x2 houses, then you build 8 new houses (2 x 2x2) ? In that case, doesn't the constructible ground decrease the desirability of that place ?

Thank you for your patience, guys.

Brugle
So it absorbs the other houses ??? What a surprise !
I thought only houses with same desirability could gather themthelves.
I think I now understand. Thanks a lot !

[This message has been edited by gornfr (edited 10-31-2006 @ 09:29 AM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 10-31-06 10:20 ET (US)     249 / 434       

Quoted from gornfr:

The thing I don't understand is how a house on the third tile away from a road will be covered by services such as food and goods, since the first 2 tiles will be covered, but the third ?

As shaun explained, whenever any tile of a house is in range of a walker supplying a "service", the house as a whole gets that service. For example, if any tile of a house is within 2 tiles of a water carrier, then the entire house has clean water.

Quoted from gornfr:

I don't even understand how a block of house can evolve to a 3x3 then 4x4 house if it has no road around it.

That's what houses do. If a 2x2 fancy residence has everything that it needs to evolve to a manor (which is everything that a fancy residence needs plus luxury goods plus a little more desirability plus a little more entertainment plus room to expand) then it will evolve to a manor (which includes expanding to 3x3). If a 3x3 stately manor has everything that it needs to evolve to an estate then it will evolve to an estate (which includes expanding to 4x4).

Quoted from gornfr:

When you say a walker has a 5x5 area coverage, isn't it 2 tiles to both sides of the road ?

When a service-providing walker reaches the center of a tile, it provides coverage to everything within 2 tiles of its current position, which is everything within a 5x5 square. As you indicated, that means that a service-providing walker walking down a straight road will eventually cover everything within 2 tiles of that road.

Quoted from gornfr:

So I guess you begin with a 2x2 house, or 2 2x2 houses, then you build 8 new houses (2 x 2x2) ? In that case, doesn't the constructible ground decrease the desirability of that place ?

Yes, vacant lots are somewhat undesirable.

Quoted from gornfr:

So it absorbs the other houses ??? What a surprise !
I thought only houses with same desirability could gather themthelves.

There are 2 different ways that houses can combine. One is that a house which expands while evolving (1x1 spacious apartment to a 2x2 common residence, 2x2 fancy residence to a 3x3 common manor, or 3x3 stately manor to a 4x4 modest estate) can expand over bare ground, gardens, vacant lots, and lower-level houses, and will absorb any lower-level house (or part of a lower-level house) that it expands over.

Another way that houses may combine is when a square of four 1x1 houses of the same type merge into a 2x2 house of that type. (For merging purposes, a vacant lot in the east, south, or west position of a four-tile square is considered to be a crude hut.) This will happen in some locations of a given map but not in others, and the locations that allow merging are "randomly" determined when the map is created. Desirability does not affect such merging directly, but it can affect merging indirectly if desirability differences cause houses to be of different types, since four 1x1 houses of different types will not merge.

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 10-31-2006 @ 10:28 AM).]

gornfr
Pleb
posted 10-31-06 10:35 ET (US)     250 / 434       
Brugle
Thank you very much for all those explanations !!!
I didn't know a house could expand over bare ground and other thing... That will be very helpful !
Once again thank you very much !
« Previous Page  1 ··· 8 9 10 11 12 ··· 18  Next Page »
You must be logged in to post messages.
Please login or register

Hop to:    

Caesar IV Heaven | HeavenGames