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Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » Pharaoh: Game Help » Stable Sauty
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Topic Subject:Stable Sauty
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Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 09-11-19 17:20 ET (US)         
About 10 years ago, I looked at Nero Would's spoiler maps and saw that Iunet eventually stopped having events that required intervention (such as invasions). I built Immortal Iunet (the second time I built Iunet), but it had problems. Over 6 years later, I built a quite different Improved Immortal Iunet), which become stable and ran for thousands of years without intervention (and my guess is that it would have run much longer).

There is another family history city that also eventually stopped having events requiring intervention: Sauty. Now that I've completed the Middle Kingdom, it's time for Stable Sauty.

Sauty can farm pomegranates and flax on floodplain and meadow, dig clay, mine gems, quarry limestone and plain stone, and manufacture bricks, pottery, beer, linen, jewelry, chariots, warships, and transports. Gods are Osiris (with temple complex), Ra, and Seth. Requirements are Culture 70, Prosperity 75, 6500 people, 3 medium mudbrick pyramids, and burial provisions. Stable Sauty will be built with Cleopatra.

These personal rules will apply:
* Very Hard difficulty
* Culture 70 (the maximum without zoos)
* Prosperity 100
* All houses are residences or better
* No debt and no "rescue gift"
* Personal funds are not used
* No cheats
* Schools, libraries, mortuaries, and senet house are kept supplied with goods
* Teachers, librarians, embalmers, and senet players do not use long (forced) walks
* Palace, mansion, temple complex, and the best houses are together
* No festivals
* Regular traffic goes through the festival square
* All roads, including the rerouted Kingdom road, are connected
* Every entertainment venue has a show part of the time
* Adequate defense
* People are always registered for tax
* Bazaars and water supplies are upgraded
* People will give the best comments--a dancer will say "This city is fantastic!"
* Except for trade quotas and farm fertility and flood length, no "future history"
* Nothing that I build is deleted (except by an event), unless I screw up

City Health and Population

Culture 70 requires 80% physician coverage and 40% mortuary coverage. With all houses residences or better, I don't think city health could be as low as average. Since I want few ghosts (people who reach 100 years old and disappear from the population but still take space in houses, eat, and pay taxes) in a city of at least 6500 people with better than average city health, this requires (as described in reply #97 of Are there any truly eternal cities in Caesar 3?) a minimum of about 10653 people, which is at good city health.

To prevent city health from being very good, some houses will not have physician coverage.


Is Stable Sauty possible? I didn't know earlier (so I didn't post), but now I believe so. A preliminary design appears OK, although it has too much unemployment.

My reports will be short (for me), so feel free to ask questions. They will also be slow, for multiple reasons.


Warning: the replies have spoilers.
AuthorReplies:
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 10-29-19 06:55 ET (US)     26 / 53       
Wasn't minimising money a consideration for Iunet so you didn't exceed the maximum limit?
No, I didn't run either of them long enough (tens of thousands of years) to hit the money limit. If I reduced the tax rate enough, they could run for hundreds of thousands of years (assuming they were otherwise stable).

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 10-29-2019 @ 06:57 AM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 10-31-19 14:56 ET (US)     27 / 53       
Stable Sauty (Lykopolis)--early years, progressive was approved.


14th Year (1528 BC)

Rowarty was conquered. Our warships returned, with moderate damage to one which was repaired. The price of linen increased by 30 Db.

15 vacant lots in the SW block, 7th and 8th (last) weavers, 12th (last) architect post, 7th and 8th (last) granaries, 2nd Seth temple in the N block, 2nd dentist in the N block, and 3rd courthouse for the NW block were built.

The 14th year ended with 4752 people (432 in spacious manors, 300 in common manors, 184 in fancy residences, 504 in spacious residences, 1440 in common residences, 884 in spacious homesteads, 1008 in meager shanties), 20139 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 44, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-02-19 11:53 ET (US)     28 / 53       
I forgot to mention that bazaars were built in the 13th year, so I edited reply #24.


Another Design Error

A recently built granary didn't have quite enough damage protection. Again, the solution was to move an existing architect post (so that he walks by the granary twice in four walks instead of once).


15th Year (1527 BC)

9 vacant lots in the SW block, 3rd school for the NW block, 11th through 13th (last) bazaars in the SE, S, and SW blocks, and 2nd conservatory were built. An existing architect post was deleted and rebuilt 4 tiles away.

Menat Khufu sold plain stone.

The 15th year ended with 5063 people (432 in spacious manors, 300 in common manors, 184 in fancy residences, 2016 in spacious residences, 988 in spacious apartments, 1143 in meager shanties), 31870 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 45, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-03-19 18:05 ET (US)     29 / 53       
16th Year (1526 BC)

The army at Sharuhen requested troops against a small force in 10 months and 32 archers and 32 charioteers were dispatched.

14 vacant lots in the SE and S blocks, 9th Ra shrine, 11th Seth shrine, 3rd Ra temple for the NW block, 3rd dentist in the NW block, 4th pavilion in the SE block, and last large statues were built.

The 16th year ended with 5284 people (432 in spacious manors, 500 in common manors, 736 in fancy residences, 176 in elegant residences, 1176 in spacious residences, 1040 in common residences, 1224 in meager shanties), 45354 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 46, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-05-19 11:30 ET (US)     30 / 53       
17th Year (1525 BC)

Sharuhen was conquered. Our soldiers returned, with 4 archer and 4 charioteer casualties.

2 vacant lots in the SE block, 10th Ra shrine, 12th Seth shrine, and last medium statue were built. For the first time, some floodplain farms did not harvest: pomegranates from 60% of the farms were lost. We are drowning in pomegranates!

Itjtawy sold bricks.

The 17th year ended with 5494 people (432 in spacious manors, 500 in common manors, 1196 in fancy residences, 2016 in spacious residences, 1350 in meager shanties), 58167 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 47, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-06-19 17:32 ET (US)     31 / 53       
Minor Play Error

I forgot to plaza a not-yet-built road touching the NE side of the festival square, which now has a fort nearby. It's only for aesthetics, but since the "no delete" rule has already been broken (twice), I built the road and 5 small statues, plazaed the road, then deleted those statues.


18th Year (1524 BC)

27 vacant lots in the S and SE blocks and 2nd juggler school were built. Temporary small statues were deleted.

The 18th year ended with 5576 people (432 in spacious manors, 500 in common manors, 1932 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 1368 in meager shanties), 73465 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 48, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-07-19 16:04 ET (US)     32 / 53       
19th Year (1523 BC)

12 vacant lots in the S and SE blocks and 23rd firehouse were built. 2 loads of bricks were lost on the 4th course, because bricklayers or the construction foreman screwed up.

The 19th year ended with 5859 people (432 in spacious manors, 1000 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 1611 in meager shanties), 92962 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 49, and good health.


20th Year (1522 BC)

13th Seth shrine and 3rd Seth temple for the SW block were built.

Ki fell due to not meeting the culture or monument milestones.

The 20th year ended with 5975 people (540 in spacious manors, 900 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 1719 in meager shanties), 112845 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 48, and good health.

[Changed "temple in the SW block" to "temple for the SW block".]

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 11-08-2019 @ 07:26 PM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-08-19 19:31 ET (US)     33 / 53       
Minor edit to reply #32.


21st Year (1521 BC)

4th through 6th (last) courthouses in the SE, S, and SW blocks, 5th through 8th (last) pavilions in the S and SW blocks and two in the pavilion/bandstand complex, and 3rd and 4th (last) dance schools were built.

The 21st year ended with 6263 people (540 in spacious manors, 900 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 936 in rough cottages, 1071 in meager shanties), 129253 Db, Cu 40, Pr 100, Ki 49, and good health.


22nd Year (1520 BC)

4th (last) Ra temple for the SE and S blocks and 3rd conservatory were built. The tax rate was lowered to 13%.

The 22nd year ended with 6551 people (540 in spacious manors, 900 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 1224 in spacious homesteads, 1071 in meager shanties), 151165 Db, Cu 40, Pr 100, Ki 50, and good health.


23rd Year (1519 BC)

4th through 6th meadow pomegranate farms and 3rd (last) mortuary in the NW block were built. Another load of bricks was lost on the 6th course, because bricklayers or the construction foreman screwed up. Half of the burial provisions (1600 pottery, 800 linen, 800 luxury goods, 4 chariots) were dispatched.

The 23rd year ended with 7265 people (540 in spacious manors, 900 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 1224 in spacious homesteads, 1785 in ordinary cottages), 170374 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 51, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-10-19 17:14 ET (US)     34 / 53       
24th Year (1518 BC)

A library for the NW block was built. Except for 1 chariot, the remainder of the burial provisions (1600 pottery, 800 linen, 800 luxury goods, 3 chariots) were dispatched.

The 24th year ended with 7409 people (756 in spacious manors, 700 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 1344 in spacious residences, 2312 in spacious homesteads, 825 in ordinary cottages), 185700 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 52, and good health.


25th Year (1517 BC)

5 vacant lots in the S block were built.

The 25th year ended with 7531 people (864 in spacious manors, 600 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 88 in an elegant residence, 1260 in spacious residences, 3247 in spacious homesteads), 204995 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 53, and good health.


26th Year (1516 BC)

14th Seth shrine and 4th school for the SW block were built. A carpenter was barely lost in the flood.

The 26th year ended with 7628 people (972 in spacious manors, 500 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 176 in elegant residences, 1176 in spacious residences, 3332 in spacious homesteads), 222444 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 54, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-11-19 18:49 ET (US)     35 / 53       
27th Year (1515 BC)

5th school for the SE and S blocks was built. For the first time, the flood was poor (the worst with Osiris's temple complex), which didn't reach some floodplain farms.

The 27th year ended with 7852 people (1080 in spacious manors, 400 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 176 in elegant residences, 1176 in spacious residences, 1440 in common residences, 2108 in spacious homesteads), 242647 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 55, and good health.


28th Year (1514 BC)

24th firehouse and 2nd library for the NE block were built.

The 28th year ended with 8040 people (1188 in spacious manors, 300 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 176 in elegant residences, 1176 in spacious residences, 2640 in common residences, 1088 in spacious homesteads), 261012 Db, Cu 25, Pr 100, Ki 56, and good health.


29th Year (1513 BC)

2 vacant lots in the NE block and a booth were built.

The 29th year ended with 8252 people (1296 in spacious manors, 200 in common manors, 1472 in fancy residences, 440 in elegant residences, 924 in spacious residences, 3920 in common residences), 282493 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 57, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-12-19 18:57 ET (US)     36 / 53       
30th Year (1512 BC)

1 vacant lot in the SE block was built.

Menat Khufu sold beer. Ki fell due to not meeting the culture or monument milestones.

The 30th year ended with 8302 people (1338 in spacious manors, 200 in common manors, 1656 in fancy residences, 264 in elegant residences, 924 in spacious residences, 3920 in common residences), 302877 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 56, and good health. For the second time, a house finished the year with vacancies (66), but this time it was deliberate. (Over several years, a few houses should end each year with vacancies, but I will try to make the number within 1 of the number the previous year.)


31st Year (1511 BC)

3 vacant lots in the NW block were built. Another carpenter was lost in the flood.

The 31st year ended with 8407 people (1372 in spacious manors, 200 in common manors, 1748 in fancy residences, 176 in elegant residences, 924 in spacious residences, 3987 in common residences), 325949 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 57, and good health.


32nd Year (1510 BC)

The last bricks were hauled to the pyramid. The 2nd pyramid was placed on the S bank between the lakes.

The 32nd year ended with 8515 people (1419 in spacious manors, 200 in common manors, 2052 in fancy residences, 88 in an elegant residence, 756 in spacious residences, 4000 in common residences), 349706 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 58, and good health.

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 11-13-2019 @ 03:13 PM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-13-19 18:43 ET (US)     37 / 53       
33rd Year (1509 BC)

25th firehouse, 11th through 14th Ra shrines, Osiris's temple for the NW block, and senet house for the NE block were built.

The 33rd year ended with 8589 people (1438 in spacious manors, 200 in common manors, 2275 in fancy residences, 88 in an elegant residence, 588 in spacious residences, 4000 in common residences), 367409 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 59, and good health.


34th Year (1508 BC)

4th (last) Seth temple for the NE block was built.

The 34th year ended with 8690 people (635 in elegant manors, 864 in spacious manors, 200 in common manors, 2315 in fancy residences, 88 in an elegant residence, 588 in spacious residences, 4000 in common residences), 386665 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 60, and good health.


35th Year (1507 BC)

1 vacant lot in the SE block was built. The last limestone was hauled to the 1st pyramid and polishing began.

The 35th year ended with 8877 people (744 in stately manors, 884 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 2629 in fancy residences, 420 in spacious residences, 4000 in common residences), 410431 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 61, and very good health.

[Changed "good health" to "very good health" in the 35th year.]

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 11-14-2019 @ 12:33 PM).]

Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-14-19 12:36 ET (US)     38 / 53       
Two More Play Errors

One is that I missed that health "improved" to very good in the 35th year, so I edited reply #37.

The other is that I let it happen! Experiments showed that the danger was health changing from good to very good (not average). But I like advanced scribal housing, so (without considering the consequences) I created elegant and stately manors in the NW and NE blocks in the last two years. Since those blocks have both physician and mortuary coverage (and eat two foods), this can "improve" city health.

To bring health back to good, I will significantly increase the number of people on the S bank who do not have mortuary coverage (and eat one food) and the number of people in the N block who do not have physician coverage (who eat two foods, but I think the lack of physician coverage is more important). I will ignore the number of houses with vacancies at the end of a year (which probably didn't matter anyway).
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-15-19 15:00 ET (US)     39 / 53       
36th Year (1506 BC)

49 vacant lots (46 in Jan) in the N, SE, S, and SW blocks and 3 bandstands were built. 2nd pyramid site preparation finished. 1st pyramid is done.

The 36th year ended with 9711 people (744 in stately manors, 903 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3194 in fancy residences, 4670 in common residences), 434096 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 62, and good health.


37th Year (1505 BC)

7th through 13th meadow pomegranate farms were built. Brick and limestone were hauled to the 2nd pyramid. A load of bricks was lost on the 1st course.

The 37th year ended with 9977 people (744 in stately manors, 920 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3242 in fancy residences, 4871 in common residences), 457966 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 63, and good health.


38th Year (1504 BC)

4 vacant lots in the NW and S blocks were built.

The 38th year ended with 10142 people (744 in stately manors, 928 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3288 in fancy residences, 4982 in common residences), 481567 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 64, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-16-19 14:37 ET (US)     40 / 53       
39th Year (1503 BC)

15th through 18th Ra shrines and 15th through 18th Seth shrines were built. Another load of bricks was lost on the 2nd course of the 2nd pyramid.

The 39th year ended with 10328 people (744 in stately manors, 928 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3342 in fancy residences, 5114 in common residences), 505725 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 65, and good health.


40th Year (1502 BC)

Three more loads of bricks were lost on the 3rd course of the 2nd pyramid.

The 40th year ended with 10454 people (860 in stately manors, 812 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3382 in fancy residences, 5200 in common residences), 534436 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 66, and good health.


41st Year (1501 BC)

Two more loads of bricks were lost on the 4th course of the 2nd pyramid.

The 41st year ended with 10502 people (868 in stately manors, 812 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3422 in fancy residences, 5200 in common residences), 554751 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 67, and good health.


42nd Year (1500 BC)

The 42nd year ended with 10536 people (868 in stately manors, 812 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3456 in fancy residences, 5200 in common residences), 578793 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 68, and good health.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-17-19 14:46 ET (US)     41 / 53       
43rd Year (1499 BC)

Last vacant lot in the SE block and last small statue were built.

The 43rd year ended with 10565 people (868 in stately manors, 812 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3485 in fancy residences, 5200 in common residences), 602325 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 69, and good health.


44th Year (1498 BC)

Another load of bricks was lost on the 6th course of the 2nd pyramid.

The 44th year ended with 10642 people (868 in stately manors, 812 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3496 in fancy residences, 5266 in common residences), 626940 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 70, and good health.


45th Year (1497 BC)

Last plazas were built.

The 45th year ended with 10656 people (984 in stately manors, 696 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3496 in fancy residences, 5280 in common residences), 653229 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 71, and good health.


46th Year (1496 BC)

The 46th year ended with 10664 people (992 in stately manors, 696 in elegant manors, 200 in common manors, 3496 in fancy residences, 5280 in common residences), 681426 Db, Cu 35, Pr 100, Ki 72, and good health. The final population (before ghosts).


Using Trium's Utilities, Stable Sauty (assuming it's stable) will form 35 ghosts, the first in the 101st year (1441 BC) and the last in the 3434th year (1892 AD).
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-18-19 18:25 ET (US)     42 / 53       
Fixed typo in reply #2.


The bricklayer guild lost employees for a short time. This is apparently caused by the citizen and the bricklayers sharing the same cycle of four walks, since I placed the bricklayer guild (and the stonemason guild) where the citizen does not go by houses on every walk. This loss of employees could occur in the final city, so I edited reply #3 (again).


There will be less reporting.

The last bricks were hauled to the 2nd pyramid. The 3rd (last) pyramid was placed on the S bank close to the exit. The 50th year (1492 BC) ended with 786568 Db, Cu 35, and Ki 76.

The last limestone was hauled to the 2nd pyramid and polishing began. The 53rd year (1489 BC) ended with 869943 Db, Cu 35, and Ki 79.

2nd pyramid is done. 3rd pyramid site preparation finished. The 55th year (1487 BC) ended with 924929 Db, Cu 35, and Ki 81.

14th through 18th (last) meadow pomegranate farms and 4th through 6th (last) dentists were built. Brick and limestone were hauled to the 3rd pyramid. The 56th year (1486 BC) ended with 950439 Db, Cu 40, and Ki 82.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-19-19 17:45 ET (US)     43 / 53       
11th through 14th (last) Osiris shrines, 19th through 25th (last) Ra shrines, and 19th through 25th (last) Seth shrines were built. A load of bricks was lost on the 3rd course of the 3rd pyramid. The 59th year (1483 BC) ended with 1025767 Db, Cu 40, and Ki 85.

2nd through 9th (last) booths were built. The 61st year (1481 BC) ended with 1079548 Db, Cu 55, and Ki 87.

Two more loads of bricks were lost on the 5th course of the 3rd pyramid. The 62nd year (1480 BC) ended with 1102316 Db, Cu 55, and Ki 88.

Another load of bricks was lost on the 5th course (again!) of the 3rd pyramid. The 63rd year (1479 BC) ended with 1129934 Db, Cu 55, and Ki 89.

The last bricks were hauled to the 3rd pyramid. The 71st year (1471 BC) ended with 1338475 Db, Cu 55, and Ki 97.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-20-19 13:04 ET (US)     44 / 53       
The last limestone was hauled to the 3rd pyramid and polishing began. Trade and Special orders were given their final settings. The 74th year (1468 BC) ended with 1424380 Db, Cu 55, and Ki 100.

3rd (last) pyramid is done. Personal salary was set to 100 Db/month (appropriate for the rank). The 76th year (1466 BC) ended with 1479601 Db, Cu 55, and Ki 100.

4th and 5th (last) bandstands and last roads were built. The 100th year (1442 BC) ended with 10664 people, 2138667 Db, Cu 60, and Ki 100. First ghost is early the next year.


Sauty's exit point is not on the Kingdom Road, since caravans will go "cross country" when leaving the city. (Heh has the same "problem".)
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-21-19 13:52 ET (US)     45 / 53       
26th (last) firehouse, 6th (last) school, 4th and 5th (last) conservatories, and 3rd through 6th (last) juggler schools were built. The 148th year (1394 BC) ended with 10663 people, 3453830 Db, and Cu 65. 2nd ghost is early the next year.

3rd (last) library, all 6 apothecaries, and last gardens were built. Construction is done. The 159th year (1383 BC) ended with 10662 people, 3745233 Db, and Cu 70. 3rd ghost is early the next year.

The tax rate was raised to 17%--the last intervention. The 436th year (1106 BC) ended with 10656 people, 10776260 Db, and Cu 70. 9th ghost is early the next year.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-22-19 16:02 ET (US)     46 / 53       
The 3433rd year (1891 AD) ended with 10630 people and 124416827 Db. 35th (last) ghost is early the next year, when demographics became a 190-year cycle.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-23-19 15:49 ET (US)     47 / 53       
A game in the 5437th year (3895 AD) was saved for the Downloads, after 5000 years without intervention. Personal funds were 6432100 Db. If the last burial provision (1 chariot) is dispatched, victory is declared immediately with these results:
Culture: 70
Prosperity: 100
Kingdom: 100
funds: 200360311
population: 10629
months: 65232
level: Very Hard
score: 163134

Stable Sauty was submitted to the Downloads along with two earlier saves: shortly before the 3rd ghost formed with construction complete and shortly before the 9th ghost formed when taxes were raised (the last intervention).

[Added: Stable Sauty (Lykopolis) was approved.]

[This message has been edited by Brugle (edited 11-24-2019 @ 07:41 AM).]

Cfilorvy666
Pleb
posted 11-25-19 23:57 ET (US)     48 / 53       
Very nice

Hetepsenusret next?
evil_live_vile
Pleb
posted 11-26-19 03:31 ET (US)     49 / 53       
Very nice indeed.

Even with some forced-walkers, the amount of intersections being managed on non-looping roads is really impressive.

Eagles may soar, but weasels do not get sucked into jet engines
Two Eskimos sitting in a kayak were chilly, so they lit a fire in the craft. Unsurprisingly it sank, Proving once again that you can't have your kayak and heat it too
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 11-26-19 08:55 ET (US)     50 / 53       
Hetepsenusret next?
I have considered that, but my guess is that my next Pharaoh city will be Khmun. As evil_live_vile pointed out, I have not yet fought a battle with chariots.

However, after some rest (maybe a lot), I think my next city will be in C3, perhaps a 1 granary Massilia.
Cruisecontrol
Pleb
posted 01-21-20 06:29 ET (US)     51 / 53       
This is my first time posting here, but I've found this website and forum an invaluable mine of information which has helped a great deal, so thank you to all who have contributed to it. I do now have a question which I can't find a good answer to with regards to making a city stable over a long period of time. I am also trying to complete Sauty and, mostly due to my incompetence, took far too long to complete the pyramids, and after a period of time found that the number of available workers declined year on year. I understand that this is down to workers retiring/children being born, however I expected this to level off at some point, but it only seemed to get worse and worse (at one point only around 20% of my population were able to work).

From what I've read of this thread it seems that you (Brugle) did not experience this at all, and I'm not very clear on why this would be? Is it likely simply a case of having built too many houses too quickly thereby having too many people retiring in consecutive years? Or does city health also play a part - i.e. do people live longer if city health is better thereby exacerbating the problem? I have seen the 'solutions' given in other threads of deleting water supplies etc in order to get people to move out and back in again, but that seems a rather unsatisfactory answer to me and would rather avoid that if possible.

I also have a separate, although slightly related question for Brugle - what do you use as your baseline percentage of your population who are able to work? I have been using the Pharaoh Housing Worksheet which defaults to 40%, but this is far too high once the original immigrants to your city start retiring.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 01-21-20 11:25 ET (US)     52 / 53       
Hi Cruisecontrol, welcome to Pharaoh Heaven as a poster.
I expected this to level off at some point, but it only seemed to get worse and worse (at one point only around 20% of my population were able to work ... it seems that you (Brugle) did not experience this at all
After all houses were full (in the 46th year), I didn't build several things (4 meadow pomegranate farms, 3 dentists, 8 booths, 2 bandstands, 4 juggler schools, 2 conservatories, 1 firehouse, 1 school, 1 library, and 6 apothecaries) for a while, to make worker shortages easier to handle.

I didn't report nearly as much about employment as I did in the previous city I built to last for a long time. (Improved Immortal Iunet is similar to Stable Sauty, with the same health (good)--you may want to look at replies #56 and #57.)
does city health also play a part - i.e. do people live longer if city health is better thereby exacerbating the problem?
Yes, after a while. (Details are in Census - Death Rates.)

Although they are for very long-lived cities, you may want to look at replies #96 and #97 in Are there any truly eternal cities in Caesar 3?.
what do you use as your baseline percentage of your population who are able to work?
Obviously, I use the fraction of non-scribes.

If I don't know how long the mission will take (as in Heh), or if I want the city to run for longer after I finish (which I've done fairly often), I'll build only a small number of manors or estates and accept high unemployment. Otherwise, if I expect to finish within 15 years or so, I assume a little over 40%, somewhat lower if I expect it to take a bit longer (say 20 years).

I haven't built Hetepsenusret (which takes a long time) yet--I don't know what I'll do there.
Cruisecontrol
Pleb
posted 01-22-20 14:29 ET (US)     53 / 53       
Thanks for the welcome and reply, it certainly made for interesting reading. If I were to aim for a long lasting city, I'd firstly need to be much more efficient in terms of how many workers are needed - despite my city having about 3000 fewer people, it still needed about the same number of workers. I'll try again just to complete it in a reasonable timeframe avoiding mistakes made in my first attempt, then perhaps try again where the aim is to make it longer lasting.
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