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Caesar III: Game Help
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Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » Caesar III: Game Help » Introducing second food source - help needed
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Topic Subject:Introducing second food source - help needed
Heleen
Pleb
posted 12-17-18 04:38 ET (US)         
So how does this work again? I know the market ladies have a preference, but I don't remember the exact order. I know they go for wheat first, but after that?

The problem I have is this: sometimes when I introduce a second food source, my housing devolves because the market ladies apparently start walking to some distant granary to get a certain kind of food.

For example: I just replayed Lindum for the first time in years. I had them on vegetables as only food source, until I wanted to evolve to grand insulae and switched some of the vegetable farms out for fruit farms. After that, it took me some time - in which I tweaked the amount of fruit vs vegetable farms - until I had my main blocks stable again. I thought the market ladies went for vegetables first anyway so didn't think introducing fruit would be a problem, but it happened anyway. Do the markets go for fruit first? Or will they always try to find a second food source first before getting stuff like pottery and furniture? I can't seem to find this info again.
AuthorReplies:
Yahya
Pleb
posted 12-17-18 06:53 ET (US)     1 / 9       
Priorities are: wheat, vegetables, fruit, and meat/fish, in that order.

Market buyers always prioritize food, and I believe they will prioritize a 2nd food type over goods.

A way to prevent this is granary distance. A buyer won't retrieve food from a granary with its northern tile more than 40 blocks away from the market's northern tile, as the crow flies.

So ignoring road length, if the fruit granary is 41 tiles or more away from the market, it should prevent the buyer from retrieving the fruit.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 12-17-18 07:13 ET (US)     2 / 9       
Hi Heleen,

I had a reply prepared, but then saw that Yahya beat me again!
Market buyers always prioritize food, and I believe they will prioritize a 2nd food type over goods.
That is true if they are out of a food or good.

If you care, the full market buyer rule is more complicated. Of the available foods and goods which the market wants, if the market has less than 50 of a food or good, the market buyer will get the one that has the lowest stock, and if that picks multiple foods and/or goods then it will get the first of these: wheat, vegetables, fruit, meat/fish, pottery, furniture, oil, wine. Otherwise, the market buyer will get the last food listed in the previous sentence that is below the restocking level (600 wheat or 400 of another food).
A buyer won't retrieve food from a granary with its northern tile more than 40 blocks away from the market's northern tile, as the crow flies.
Actually, a buyer won't go if the distance is more than 39 tiles.

This method is difficult. I think I've only used it in 3 cities, all in cities that I'd built before.

The easiest way to avoid the problem is to build a city in separate sections that are not connected by roads, so market buyers cannot go very far.

However, if you have markets that are connected to fairly distant granaries, you may avoid (or at least minimize) the problem by only developing one housing block at a time to grand insulae. Keep the others at low levels, perhaps small casas.
Heleen
Pleb
posted 12-17-18 10:36 ET (US)     3 / 9       
Market buyers always prioritize food, and I believe they will prioritize a 2nd food type over goods.
I'm guessing they do, because some of the houses eventually devolved down all the way to small casa, and none below that.

And I thought the order you mentioned was the one they used, as this is the same order as the menu to set granaries to gives. This didn't make sense to me though, unless of course they prioritize a second food source over goods.

And yes, Brugle, our King (I'm sorry, Caesar ;-)) of disconnected blocks. I usually have two or three interconnected blocks that I evolve all the way (as far as is practical in that particular mission), and then two or more other interconnected ones that aren't connected with the main ones, if that makes sense. I very rarely use more than one (maaaybe three) disconnected parts. I think this is because efficiency isn't my strongsuit so I tend to overproduce stuff to be sure - and overproducing the same food or good four or more times (i.e. per disconnected block) doesn't go well in terms of employment. I also find not having too many disconnected blocks easier when one or more goods need to be imported to evolve housing. I.e. the Lindum I was referring to has three large blocks that I evolve to grand insulae and that incorporates a dock to import olives and/or oil, and then on the second patch of farmland two other large blocks that are evolved only as far as medium insulae.

I had forgotten about the granary distance though, thanks Yahya! I've (re-)finished both of the campaigns for now and decided to go on to Pharaoh for a bit at first (or who knows, maybe do some actual work for a change? :-p) but maybe I'll redo Lindum shortly just for the heck of it and try this out.

And of course as Brugle says- leaving other blocks at small casas also helps. But of course, as long as the pottery is there, it only takes building and staffing a bath and an amphitheater to develop small casas to small insulae (at least this is true when playing on hard; I wouldn't know about VH). And sometimes the extra tax money you can generate by developing them further much earlier in the history of a city is just really, really welcome.
Yahya
Pleb
posted 12-17-18 11:32 ET (US)     4 / 9       
I had a reply prepared, but then saw that Yahya beat me again!
Alas, I am like lightning, at times.
Otherwise, the market buyer will get the last food listed in the previous sentence that is below the restocking level (600 wheat or 400 of another food).
So that is, they will get the lowest item (less than 50), selecting from that list in order in the case of a tie, or they will get the item less than the restocking level among that list, but in reverse order.

Do I have that correct?
Actually, a buyer won't go if the distance is more than 39 tiles.
Thanks for the correction!
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 12-17-18 11:32 ET (US)     5 / 9       
as Brugle says- leaving other blocks at small casas also helps
I meant to leave houses at small casas as a temporary measure to make development easier. If you have 3 blocks connected by roads that all need to be settled early, you could leave 2 blocks at small casas and evolve one block to grand insulae, then evolve another block to grand insulae, and finally evolve the third block to grand insulae.

If connected blocks don't need to be settled at the same time, it may be easier to only settle one block at a time.
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 12-17-18 11:35 ET (US)     6 / 9       
I am like lightning, at times
This time you only beat me by a few seconds.
Do I have that correct?
Yes.
Yahya
Pleb
posted 12-17-18 16:37 ET (US)     7 / 9       
This time you only beat me by a few seconds.
I'd rather be lucky than good.

Of course, I'd also rather be correct than incorrect, but unfortunately that's not always the case.
Heleen
Pleb
posted 12-18-18 03:32 ET (US)     8 / 9       
I meant to leave houses at small casas as a temporary measure to make development easier.
Yeah, I got that :-). But like I said: sometimes developing blocks earlier in the city's history is quite helpful if you're short on Denarii. Of course though with disconnected blocks it's easier to control the evolution of houses and develop every house up to say medium insulae and only one block to grand insulae in a mission where you don't have enough oil for everyone.

Now that I read my own reply of the other day, I see that I should've added to the part about overproducing stuff that I don't like to work with "getting" warehouses too much in Caesar, because it takes a bit of micro-managing to get this right for goods that you're a bit short on (which mostly means: the ones you need to import). I feel this works better in Pharaoh - I think I even observed two "getting" warehouses in a disconnected palace block in Massilia getting from each other instead the warehouse by the dock where I was actually importing said good. Is that possible, or did I see a ghost?

(Speaking of ghosts: you know you've been playing too much Emperor if you pause the game because you're convinced you saw a spy.. in C3.)
Brugle
HG Alumnus
posted 12-18-18 06:49 ET (US)     9 / 9       
I think I even observed two "getting" warehouses in a disconnected palace block in Massilia getting from each other instead the warehouse by the dock where I was actually importing said good. Is that possible
That is possible, if you're using the original (unpatched) C3--the one where you can't set the difficulty level. Or the game might have been corrupted to allow that.

But I suspect that you are seeing warehouses delivering to each other. Wheat is the only good that can be imported by water in Massilia and used in a housing block, and if you are using two getting warehouses to move the imported wheat and then deliver it to a granary, and if there is another disconnected granary that accepts wheat, you could see the warehouses delivering to each other.
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