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Emperor: Game Help
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Caesar IV Heaven » Forums » Emperor: Game Help » Many questions about iron, steel, weapons.
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Topic Subject:Many questions about iron, steel, weapons.
user3
Pleb
posted 10-12-17 11:26 ET (US)         
I vaguely recall some transitional iron->steel campaigns. I think I have seen smelters become Furnaces while playing; but my memory isn't perfect, more likely it happens between missions.

Mission 1: Iron is set as the highest metal, in the iron age.
Mission 2: Steel is set as the highest metal, in the iron age.
Mission 3 (continuation of Mission 1): still in the iron age without adding steel to the resource list.

What would happen in mission 3?
Smelters become Furnaces?
Weaponsmiths accepting which metal?
Are the NPCs using iron or steel weapons?
Is there any real advantage in the weapon metal type with military actions? Trading/WHstorage doesnt specify the metal type. I'm assuming/guessing NPCs use the highest weapon metal set for the player. Can weapon metal change to iron after a steel mission?

If the steel age transition date is triggered while playing, then what happens in Mission 3, assuming iron is still used?

Does it matter if the campaign was created using the 1.0.0.0 editor? Im sure there are a few 'Soldout Software' disks being used that cant play the 1.0.1.0 PAKs.

edit in orange for clarity

[This message has been edited by user3 (edited 10-12-2017 @ 09:15 PM).]

AuthorReplies:
Gweilo
Angel
posted 10-12-17 15:00 ET (US)     1 / 6       
The consensus over the years is that these 'transitions' from one age to another are buggy. Here are threads I found on the topic:

http://caesar3.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/caeforumscgi/display.cgi?action=ct&f=19,6811,0,all

http://caesar3.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/caeforumscgi/display.cgi?action=ct&f=19,7076,0,all

I'll look for more soon.

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user3
Pleb
posted 10-18-17 00:25 ET (US)     2 / 6       
I made a little test PAK for testing.
city 0 = distant, buying bronze and bronzeware, selling bean curd and salt.
city 1 = Mission 1(600BCE) & 3(580BCE) player cities, produces bronze, bronzeware, weapons + other stuff, set resources just for this setup(no iron).
both above are set as active/visible & there are no event scripting in the 3 missions.
city 2 = Mission 2(590BCE), inactive/hidden, added iron as a resource and iron being sold.

M1 = City produced the expected stuff(bronze weaponsmith).
M2 = Bronze smelter and Iron smelter co-existed, Iron Weaponsmith was the title after a few game ticks of time. Iron was on the commodity list.
M3 = Iron disappears from commodity list. Bronze Weaponsmith continued to operate.

Next test I will change the date only to 70CE and 900CE.

years 70,80,90 same result as above
years 900,910,920 same result, ran each mission 3 years.
made city 2 visible same result, ran each mission 4~6 months.

made city 2 active: Mission 1, 2 & 3 commodity list shows iron. The now 'Iron Weaponsmith' in Mission 1 and 3 requires player to import iron. Using the 900CE~920CE start dates, ran each mission 4~6 months.
.
Conclusions? or more tests?

[This message has been edited by user3 (edited 10-18-2017 @ 02:30 AM).]

Gweilo
Angel
posted 10-18-17 05:45 ET (US)     3 / 6       
What city was mission 3 at? I can't tell from what you wrote.

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user3
Pleb
posted 10-18-17 07:41 ET (US)     4 / 6       
@ Gweilo, Mission 3 is City#1 a continuation of Mission 1.

Next test I added an event in mission 2, City#2 becomes inactive, mission complete trigger time.

In Mission 1, I placed the city#2 Trade Station then deleted it after verifying its trade commodities.

Mission 3 result
Iron commodity no longer listed.
Iron Weaponsmith becomes Bronze Weaponsmith.
Trade Station to city#2 no longer available.

Next test will be to place and leave the trade station to city#2.

Results, Trade station drops iron from its buyable produces. Otherwise same as without the Trade Station.
Mission 3 result
Iron commodity no longer listed.
Iron Weaponsmith becomes Bronze Weaponsmith.
Trade Station to city#2 drops iron.

Conclusions, please?

[This message has been edited by user3 (edited 10-18-2017 @ 08:41 AM).]

Gweilo
Angel
posted 10-18-17 08:47 ET (US)     5 / 6       
My conclusion is the same as I've always thought - it's very buggy. Having a city switch back and forth between bronze and iron even though you have progressed the timeline further is just plain silly. Somebody on the dev team failed in their testing.

Expand your fun by downloading free custom campaigns for Emperor: Rise of the Middle Kingdom.
Visit Zeus Heaven to expand your knowledge of Zeus and Poseidon.
user3
Pleb
posted 10-18-17 08:57 ET (US)     6 / 6       
Nevertheless Gweilo, it is a consistent oddity, thus I would not use the terms "buggy" or "glitch". A designer can use it or at least come to understand it.

This example could be a stepping stone to understanding the other designer triggered transitions.
bronzeware->lacquerware
iron->steel
wood->paper

I added a Campaign Download(539 when approved) of the PAK & Campaign folder(set file) for those wishing to continue the experiment/discussion.
The change I made was City#2 sells Steel rather then Iron now. Read the download page for more info when available.

[This message has been edited by user3 (edited 10-18-2017 @ 12:38 PM).]

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